Double standard!

[Birdsong73]

I’ve been approached to participate in a scuba diving adventure with the Boy Scouts in the Florida keys for a week. After looking over their website, up came a restriction on swimwear. Men have to look modest at all times and cannot wear any form fitting swimwear. Women, however, up until the maximum amount of weight allowed, can wear a form fitting one piece swimsuit. That seems like a double standard imo. Women better not complain about me having my shirt off if they can wear a form fitting swimsuit, but I cannot. BS!

[...:::sam:::...]

What a weird thing to specify. Have they had issues there before because not even jammers.

[wetman1961]

Seems an odd message to send to the boys, that men should be ashamed of their own bodies.

[devildog]

I think it's good and appropriate to set requirements when participating in events with young kids. We can expect that from organizers, for obvious reasons. There will be young boys and young girls at the event. Adults, both males and females, wearing modest swimsuits is just one of many, many regulations.

Varying from medical records, certifications, detailed physical and mental requirements, food, clothing, language, use of phones, cleanliness, and so on. Also they have "Duty to God" as one of their guidelines; obviously on the conservative side. And for an organization like the Scouts 'uniformity' is also a factor.

For you personally wearing tight swim briefs can be totally non-sexual. That does not mean it's perceived that way by others. You can disagree with that, but this is not a debate or question you should want at an event for young kids.

So I think it's logical and proper to require adult male swimwear that does not allow exposure of the genitals. For female adults it does not say "form fitting", it says "modest tankinis or one-piece swimsuits are appropriate". Clearly they want modesty and uniformity in many ways, including attire, for such events.

I disagree that this would be a double standard. I also disagree that an event like this should be used for adults to set an example or send a message to young kids about exposing their bodies in public. It's not about that.

[swimmy]

Please share with us the address of this website describing the swimsuit restrictions and weight allowances you mention. I'd love to see how its actually worded. Thanks!

[violaboy]

Very interesting. I enjoy scuba (and have gone in the Florida Keys), and because the water was so warm, most people just wore their swimsuits (and not the bodysuits), including me in my speedo. Obviously, I'm an adult so there were no issues, but I can see having more boundaries with children. Is the swimsuit restriction for the scuba dives themselves, or just generally? When we have to wear bodysuits, many people wear speedos (briefs or jammers) underneath instead of bulky shorts.

[devildog]

Please share with us the address of this website describing the swimsuit restrictions and weight allowances you mention. I'd love to see how its actually worded. Thanks!

Here the Scuba participation guide...

Code: Select all

http://www.bsaseabase.org/Resources/Participant%20Guides.aspx

In the complete context it makes a lot of sense.

[Norfcountryboy]

Women, however, up until the maximum amount of weight allowed, can wear a form fitting one piece swimsuit.

So let me check my understanding- men of any size must where one kind of swimwear, women however can wear whatever they darn well want; unless they're fat-fucks!
Do I sense a class action suit from "Ladies of size" in the offing!

[Birdsong73]

http://bsaseabase.org/filestore/seabase ... %20(1).pdf - scroll down for the height/weight restrictions. The height and weight restrictions are for all people. Given that this is a high adventure base, there is an expectation that you meet their physical qualifications on weight, blood pressure, etc. You need to have a full physical by a physician and I totally agree with that.

Here is their quote on swimsuits “Swimming Attire: Swimsuits must be modest. For males, tight fitting swim briefs or swim bottoms short enough to allow exposure are not allowed. For females, bikinis are not allowed. Modest tankinis or one- piece swimsuits are appropriate.”

I agree with Devildog and he makes numerous good points . I have been involved with Scouts for a very long time and I understand their emphasis on modesty. However, most companies that make wetsuits recommend men wear a swim brief or other like swimsuit under wetsuits. I have been diving for years and I’ll never forget trying to put on a heavy wetsuit in swim trunks. I got the most uncomfortable wedgie and no matter how much I tugged on the trunks, they would not stay put. While at the same time the scuba instructors were all wearing swim briefs or other like form fitting swimwear. I remember chuckling at the time until I tried to put on my wetsuit - the joke was on me. That is one of the reasons I purchased my first speedo before going on my first open water dive. I’ve worn one under my wetsuit ever since.
Maybe it’s reading the posts on here that gets me fired up to openly support wearing swim briefs. Or maybe it’s just I don’t like being told what to do. But, understanding the emphasis on modesty, I would never walk on the deck of the ship or around my room in a speedo. I guess I will just wear my speedo under shorts, take my wetsuit to the head, slip off my shorts and put on my wetsuit. No one will be the wiser.

[devildog]

Anyway sorry don't mind me ranting. I don't like kids. I mean... I find them extremely annoying. In supermarkets, in traffic, basically everywhere. In my own family I can tolerate them, as long as they don't start whining or crying. But if I go to a pool I prefer the competition pool, and if I go to the beach I prefer an adult beach.

[Speedoaddict]

I love kids. I have a 9yr old niece, a god son who is now 19. I am a bigger kid they they are.
I can see why they do it (I don’t agree with it), but I do see it.
They are trying to stop what they think of as men exposing themselves to people who do not want to see men in speedos and showing their junk through the trunk, by doing this they are trying to cut off the complaints from probably women before they start. People also think men wearing a speedo (as we have discussed many times on this forum) are gay.
You go to places like Greece, Canary Islands, Italy and other parts of the Med and you won’t find this.
It’s only in places like the USA and UK, where attitudes towards this kind of swimwear (Speedos for men and bikinis for women) are frowned upon.
As for the larger size men and women wearing them don’t they think they have enough to contend with. I myself am on the large size and I have a self image problem, but who are they to tell me what to wear. It’s like going to the gym and being told I can’t wear shorts because I am to big and I have to wear a track suit. I think you can also put some of this down to political correctness. They are scared of upsetting the majority (their customers) and picking on the minority (speedo wearers, bikini wearers, men and women of a certain size). I can’t see this changing either. Magazines push good looking men and women, toned and tanned saying this is how you should look. Until companies (other than those focusing towards the gay community as far as Speedos go, start marketing the speedo to main stream men as beach wear, swim wear and public pools encourage the wearing of Speedos and bikini on health and environmental reasons then the attitudes of people as they stand will remain as the status quo.
I hope this makes a bit of sense.
This is only an idea of what might be going on in these small minded idiots heads. So please don’t have ago at me.

[ChicagoDan]

If you don't like kids, why are you going on a Boy Scout scuba excursion?

[chicagoswim]

If you don't like kids, why are you going on a Boy Scout scuba excursion?

Birdsong was the OP about the excursion. Devil dog was the one who mentioned not liking kids. I also got confused and had to scroll back up to sort it out.


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[swimmy]

Okay I totally get the weight and body fat and fitness concern, they just don't want to have medical emergencies. I appreciate that they prefer people who can set a good example accompanying the scouts. However, it was being around really out of shape, miserably unfit dads of friends and some teachers that made me decide that was not the way to be and I promised myself I'd never be like that. So I hope they will encourage those ineligible for the adventures to definitely join in the activities they are welcome at, with full access for emergency paramedics and medivac helicopters.... The boys should see what the overly casual lifestyle of too many donuts and diet Dr. Peppers will do to a man.
As for the swimsuit rule, they sure found a nice way to say they don't want any gay attire, didn't they? It's the Boy Scouts, they have had enough of the trouble and jokes about it and no doubt would do anything to prevent having more, regardless of how uncomfortable board shorts will be in the wetsuit.
I am certain every policy and every word of the printed guidelines has been very carefully scrutinized and edited by their attorneys, too. And I don't think there is any double standard to complain about. Really.

[chicagoswim]

Okay I totally get the weight and body fat and fitness concern, they just don't want to have medical emergencies. I appreciate that they prefer people who can set a good example accompanying the scouts. However, it was being around really out of shape, miserably unfit dads of friends and some teachers that made me decide that was not the way to be and I promised myself I'd never be like that. So I hope they will encourage those ineligible for the adventures to definitely join in the activities they are welcome at, with full access for emergency paramedics and medivac helicopters.... The boys should see what the overly casual lifestyle of too many donuts and diet Dr. Peppers will do to a man.
As for the swimsuit rule, they sure found a nice way to say they don't want any gay attire, didn't they? It's the Boy Scouts, they have had enough of the trouble and jokes about it and no doubt would do anything to prevent having more, regardless of how uncomfortable board shorts will be in the wetsuit.
I am certain every policy and every word of the printed guidelines has been very carefully scrutinized and edited by their attorneys, too. And I don't think there is any double standard to complain about. Really.

If it’s under a wetsuit, I don’t understand the issue of wearing a speedo vs trunks/shorts. It won’t be seen, same as underwear isn’t seen under your clothing. Go into a changing room, change in a stall or a shower if you need to, and go about the excursion.


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[Scottiebum]

I don't understand the problem with the fitted swimwear and adults, it is something that can be seen in many places including TV, as I have said before wrestlers in singlets show more than speedo wearers because it is not 'contained' in a small garment.

If they are worried about inappropriate behaviour then these people should not be around kids regardless of what they are wearing!!

[Mazda3mps]

Anyway sorry don't mind me ranting. I don't like kids. I mean... I find them extremely annoying. In supermarkets, in traffic, basically everywhere. In my own family I can tolerate them, as long as they don't start whining or crying. But if I go to a pool I prefer the competition pool, and if I go to the beach I prefer an adult beach.

totally agree.. especially when kids splash around when you are trying to exercise

[PNWGuy]

I've been a Scout leader, and know that you've got to (mostly) play by their rules. That said, on a whitewater rafting outing a number of years ago I wore a very short pair of rather old American flag full-split running shorts as swimwear throughout the trip and no one said anything. I had my speedo with me, but chose not to wear it since no one else was. Everyone else wore something closer to board shorts. On a different trip, with a group of Scouts to Philmont Scout Ranch in New Mexico, we spent our last night before flying home at a motel in Albuquerque that had a pool. I comfortably stripped to my speedo to join the rest of the group in the pool. No one cared. Our troop was pretty relaxed, which was a good thing.

[ChicagoDan]

If you don't like kids, why are you going on a Boy Scout scuba excursion?

Birdsong was the OP about the excursion. Devil dog was the one who mentioned not liking kids. I also got confused and had to scroll back up to sort it out.


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My mistake. Thanks for correcting me

[chicagoswim]

If you don't like kids, why are you going on a Boy Scout scuba excursion?

Birdsong was the OP about the excursion. Devil dog was the one who mentioned not liking kids. I also got confused and had to scroll back up to sort it out.


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My mistake. Thanks for correcting me

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